How To Make Money On Pinterest In 1 Hour Per Week with Jenna Kutcher

If adding another social media to your plate sounds like the straw that will break the camel's back, you're not alone. You have to create new content. for this social media, build your following from scratch, and learn the best practices and strategies. It sounds. extremely overwhelming. And this is the exact mindset that I have been having in regards to Pinterest over the last few. years. And in the back of my head, I've been thinking, is Pinterest really even worth it? Like when I think of the major. social media apps, I admittedly oftent times leave Pinterest off the list. I mentioned things like Tik Tok and. Instagram and YouTube, but oftent times Pinterest doesn't even come to mind. But with all of that being said, it's. important to recognize a few things. Number one, Pinterest has been around for quite a while. It's not one of these. flashin the pan social media apps that's super popular one month and then no one's using it a month later. Pinterest. has been around for a long time and I use Pinterest and my wife uses Pinterest and when I talk to people about planning. for their wedding or looking up recipes, they oftentimes reference finding things on Pinterest. But there's one really. huge misconception that I had going into today's interview. And I'm going to guess it's a misconception that you have. had as well, and that is that Pinterest honestly isn't even a social media app. You're not necessarily wrong to define. it as such, but I think that after today's interview, I would categorize Pinterest as a search engine kind of. more along the lines of YouTube or even Google. Also, from today's interview, I found out that the way that I have. personally been using Pinterest for the last few years was, let's call it misguided. Today on the show, our guest. is none other than Jenna Kutcher. You might be a part of her over 1 million Instagram followers, but I bet you. didn't know that she was generating thousands of leads per month for her business using Pinterest and using a. strategy that takes only about an hour per week. I'm so excited to get to pick her brain in today's episode. And. honestly, it's quite selfish of me to do so because I've been wanting some coaching around Pinterest myself. And. after today's episode, I am absolutely going allin on Pinterest, especially considering that going allin isn't going. to cost me more than 60 minutes. So, without further ado, here's our interview. Hello, Jenno. Welcome to today's episode. Hey, thanks so much for having me. I am so excited for this. conversation. Um, because, you know, admittedly, often times in these convos, you have to kind of pretend as the. interviewer that you don't know what you're talking about. Yes. But I know very little of what I'm talking about today. Today we're going to be talking. all about Pinterest, which is something that you've been jamming out on recently. You know, we'll get into all. of the missteps and mistakes that I am definitely making. Um, so let's just get right into it. You know, why should I or. why should any small business owner listening today care about Pinterest? Because Jenna, they're probably like,. "Oh my gosh, I have so much going on with Instagram and Facebook and Tik Tok and YouTube, and now you want me to add. Pinterest, so why should I care?" Okay, so first things first, Pinterest will. never take away from the work that you're already doing. What it's going to do is elongate the lifespan of that work. that you are creating and it's going to turn like minutes and moments into. months. And so how I like to see it is this is not about adding more to your. plate. It's about digging for gold in the gold mine that you are likely sitting on and also just helping your. work work for you. And so before anyone panics and they're like not another. strategy, not another platform, I can't do it. All I'm asking you to do is. reallocate one hour of your life each week to this strategy. and it's going to. turn all of your work into something that's working for you. Gotcha. Okay, I can um I can get with that. There's. actually this post that I've this graphic that I posted a few times on Instagram talking about the average. lifespan, so to speak, of a post. And there's two things that always people freak out over when they see that post. Number one, the the lifespan of a Tik Tok is like they call it immediate decay. Basically, immediately once you. post it, dead on the vine. Exactly. Um, but then Pinterest is also on that graphic and it's like the longest. biggest bar on the graphic and people are like, "Oh my gosh, I need to get on Pinterest." So, what you're saying, I'm already like, "Oh, yeah, duh. I've even. talked about that before, but I haven't taken it seriously." So, who should be. posting on Pinterest? Who should be putting their business on Pinterest? And is there anyone who like maybe Pinterest. shouldn't be for them? Okay, this is so good. Before we dive into that, I'm going to tell you something about the lifespan of a pin. So when we think. about social, a lot of our posts will be dead within 48 hours tops, right? That's. pretty generous in my opinion. Yeah. The average lifespan of one pin, one. singular pin on Pinterest is over 13 months and that is the halflife. So 13. months. So one year from now plus, your work could still be working for you. So I just want to paint that picture. So. who should be on Pinterest? So, anyone that is creating content, and I mean. literally anyone. It doesn't matter what genre you're in. Now, when I say content, I'm talking about the stuff. that Brock talks about all the time. Whether you are a podcaster, a YouTuber, an Instagram creator, a writer, a. blogger, like you, what I love about you is you'll advocate like Instagram has a way for every type of creator to be. creating on it. So, I would say that your audience is a dream for Pinterest because they are likely creating. content. Now, who it's not for is people that don't have a clear path. So, you. might be creating content, but you might not have actually figured out, well, what is the end result of this content?. Right? We know general content creators who love like the dopamine hit of likes. and comments, but maybe they don't have a through line of like where does this lead to and what is valuable in my. ecosystem, whether it's a subscriber, an email subscriber, a sale, a call, whatever that looks like. And so if you. don't actually have something that can kind of lead traffic into treasure as I like to call it, Pinterest probably. isn't the best platform for you. And the only other thing I would say is if you don't want to have your business a year. from now or 5 years from now, Pinterest is also not the platform for you. Gotcha. Okay. So then where do we even. get started with Pinterest? Because I'm going to guess that most people here are two things. their number one, they have. a Pinterest account, but they've been pinning things for the baby shower, the wedding, the, you know, the birthday. party, whatever, but they've never actually used it for business. So, what are the steps to get started? Okay, so. this was me. So, if this is you, welcome. You're in good company. U let me tell you a quick story about how I. figured this out because it wasn't even me. So, years ago, I was white knuckling my business. I was a wedding. photographer in Wisconsin and I had finally released the white knuckle grip. on my business and said, "I need help." Right? Those three words that are so hard for all of us to utter. And I hired. my first virtual assistant. And I will never forget the first time we sat down. We sat across from each other in this small little Wisconsin cafe and she. goes, "How's Pinterest working for you?" And I looked her dead in the eye and I was like, "Okay, so let me tell you. about my clothing board. Oh, it is so on point. it's so Parisian chic and let me tell you about this house that I'm going. to build someday. It apparently has 20 bathrooms. And we were kind of laughing and she's like, "No, no, no. Like, how is it working for you, like for your. business?" And I was like, "What are you talking about?" And I had no idea that the pins that are on the platform are. brought on by Pinterest users. I feel like people go on and browse it and they just think like somehow these these. graphics are there but people don't connect the dots that like you can import a pin onto Pinterest today. You. can bring anything onto the platform. So the biggest misconception that people look at is one that is just for like. vision boards, right? It's a visual search engine and so we love using it to. plan out vacations and our homes and our outfits and all the different things. But what we're missing is that we can. actually become contributors to Pinterest. The way that pins get on there is from people bringing them onto. the platform. And so if you are someone who is casually pinning, which I love. I love Pinterest. I've never felt bad. about myself after being on Pinterest, right? Like I can go on to doom scroll on Instagram. I feel like garbage. Like,. oh, I'm not pretty enough and I'm not doing enough. Pinterest. I'm like, wow, the the sky's is the limit. But you feel. inspired. Yes, you do feel inspired. But if you are someone who is just passively. pinning, what I want for you to start paying attention to is looking at these pins through the lens of somebody put. this on here, right? The creator did or somebody that was inspired by the content. Pinterest is not social media. And this is where the biggest disconnect is. People often group Pinterest in the group of the Tik Toks and the. Instagrams. It's not a this or that. It is a totally separate camp. Pinterest is. a search engine. It is like a modern-day pretty Google. When you go into Pinterest, you're typing in, you know,. how to start a business or how to launch a podcast or how to find a red dress. with ruffly sleeves, right? We're using it in the way of a search engine, but oftent times our brain is disconnecting. it and telling us it's social media. And so, if you're getting started, first pay attention just to your user experience. and acknowledging that somebody brought these things on. And then notice what you're typing into the search bar and. how you're leveraging it as a search engine. One thing that I love that you do so well, Brock, is you often break. down what Instagram strategy is. So like when they launch a new feature, you're telling them like, okay, this is why. they're doing it, and this is their hope of it. When we look at Pinterest, what their goal is is to actually connect you. with the end result you're seeking. They want to be the connector. They want you to click the link and actually go to the. destination. They want you to get the answers and the solutions. A search engine's goal is very different than. social media. Social media wants to keep you on the app, keep you scrolling, whereas a search engine wants to be the. bridge that connects you to the solution or the answer that you're looking for. And so it totally changes the strategy. And so a lot of people too, they'll take what's working on social media and they'll bring it on to the search engine and they'll be like, "Well, this doesn't. work." but they're not actually looking through it or looking at it through the right lens. Gotcha. Okay. So, let's talk. about then how do you look through that right lens? Because you said a few times bringing these pins to Pinterest,. whether it's you as the creator or someone else bringing these pins to Pinterest. So, like what does that look. like? What does that mean? How do we actually put that into practice? Okay. So, what is incredible about Pinterest. is that any user can upload a pin and when they upload a pin, which is simply. in most cases just a graphic. When they upload the pin, you get to designate. where you are sending someone to. So, you literally get to drop in any URL. that you want. So, this could be a landing page to grow your email list. It could be your YouTube channel. It could. be your podcast. It could be your Instagram. It could be your blog, your website, your sales page. You can. literally designate any space that you have on the internet, which is pretty rare that you can point somebody in any. direction. So, the other thing about Pinterest is that it prioritizes what they consider fresh content. Now, fresh. content doesn't mean that Brock needs to publish a new video every single day. Fresh content just means that it needs to be a variation of something you've posted before. So for this episode of. your podcast, Brock, we could create 10, 15, 20, 30 different pins that all point. back to this singular piece of content as long as the graphics, the headlines,. or the visuals are unique. Now, what this means in layman's term is if you. have a good set of templates in Canva and you have a slight bit of creativity in terms of how you name things or how. you promote something, you can create an unlimited amount of pins that can point. to one piece of content. This is why it's not about adding more to your. already full plate or creating more content. It's about putting a spin on your content. And let me ask you this. real quick, Brock. What would be easier for you to do? Go into Canva, leverage a template, and create 10 different. graphics or create a brand new podcast episode, the show notes, the social clips, and all the things that accompany. it before you move on to the next. Which one's easier? Yeah, obviously 100% option A. Yes. And so what's amazing is. is that I bet your listeners right now are sitting on tens or hundreds or even. thousands of pieces of content that could have pins pointing to it. It could. be stuff that you made a year ago, two years ago that you could turn into pins to land on the Pinterest platform and. reach their viewers. So I feel like it should give you an exhale of like this is really not about doing more. It's. about making your work work harder with just a tiny bit of strategy and effort. Gotcha. Okay. So, like I'm conceptualizing this, thinking about it. It's a search engine. So, it's not. Instagram where I'm scrolling through reals. It's more like Google. But when I search something on Google nowadays, I. get like a big AI response that's never helpful. And then I get like a bunch of links and URLs and the first seven of. them are sponsored. And then there's, you know, a bunch of of not pretty, right? It's just text. It's links and headlines. So essentially, is this just. for, you know, oversimplification purposes? These pins on Pinterest are the same thing as these links on Google,. right? These these headlines. The only difference is on Pinterest, they're visually appealing. Maybe they have a graphic or a video, and then they're. still going to ultimately direct me to wherever that final destination is. Exactly. Right. And what's awesome is. that every single word on Pinterest, because it's a search engine, is searchable. So, if you take some of the. SEO or search engine optimization strategies that you are likely using in other places in your business, that's. all you need is just a tiny bit of keyword strategy. So, it could be keywords in the graphic itself. It could. be keywords in the pin title. It could be keywords in the description. All you're doing is helping Pinterest. connect people that are looking for your work with your work. Gotcha. Okay. So,. I'll tell you what I've been doing, and let me know if this is is a mistake, something wrong, something could could that could be improved. I use a. scheduling tool to schedule all of my posts for Tik Tok, Instagram, Facebook, whatever. And I'm logged into my. Pinterest. So, when I'm clicking on the little icons up at the top, I click on Pinterest. So, if it's a real that's. being posted on Instagram, the same video is being posted on Pinterest. But, I'm not adding a link to send it. anywhere. So, is that incorrect? Like would it be better if I was instead. having that link back to my Instagram or like what's going wrong with my strategy there because I've seen like literally. zero change or results from from doing what I'm currently doing. Right. So. yeah. Okay. So you can keep doing that, but I'm going to add just a teeny bit of strategy for you. So we are big fans of. set it and forget it, which is like my life. Like that is what I want. I want a crock-ot meal and I want strategies that. I can set and forget. So, if the easiest way to get your content onto Pinterest is to keep that feature selected so that. you know it's getting onto the platform, that's fantastic. You can keep that on. What I would recommend then is setting a. timer or a reminder for 20 minutes at the end of your week to go on to your. newly uploaded pins and to add a little bit of strategy. So, that's where you could add in the backlink and you could. add in a more SEO optimized title and description for your pin. Because often times when you're using different things. like Ply or Tailwind or whatever you're using to auto schedule, it's not optimized for Pinterest in terms of. searchability. And so if it's easier to just have it auto post and then you go in and tweak, there's no harm in doing. that and you're not like tanking your ability to get results. There's nothing there because again, this is the long. game. But you'll add in that strategy. And so what you can do is you can decide, okay, where do I want to send. this to? What is the best way to send it? somewhere where it's traffic, but I can turn that into something. I'm the. biggest fan of sending it to places you own on the internet, whether it's a website or a blog, versus sending it to. other platforms where you don't necessarily get to capture any sort of data or um any of their information. Um,. but what I would just say is then just go in on a Friday, look at the pins that automatically uploaded, jump in. You can. even use chatbt and say, "Write me a title for this Instagram caption." that's SEO optimized and great for. Pinterest. Drop those things in and designate where you want it to go and that's how that content will work for. you longer than when you just hit publish. Does that make sense? Yeah, that that totally makes sense and that's. that's very doable. I want to come back to a question around like graphics versus videos versus reals. Before I do. that, this is probably going to be a quicker question. Are there any sort of account settings or profile things that. we need to be aware of on Instagram? they in Instagram fashion they always over complicate it with like you could. be business, professional, creator, personal, private, whatever. Is there anything like that that we should be. aware of or make sure that we set up correctly on Pinterest? Yes. So that's a fabulous question, Brock. So you want to. make sure you're a business account. So without being a business account, you don't have access to analytics and you. also can't uh make your profile super optimized. So with a business account,. you could have like Brock Johnson, Instagram strategy expert as your title. And you teach this too with kind of like optimizing your bio. It's actually very similar to the strategies you teach in. Instagram in Pinterest. It's just again every word that you're putting in there. is searchable. And so you want to make sure the words and phrases that you're using both in your title and in your bio. are very clear. So very similar to what you teach there. You also just want to have a business account because that. will give you access to the analytics. It'll also unlock a few features like linking to your website and different. things like that as well. It's a super easy process. Once you do it once, you don't ever have to do it again. And so,. it just takes a few minutes, but that will switch your account from personal to business, which will then allow you. to kind of think a little bit more strategically and have more strategy in place. Gotcha. Okay. Totally makes sense. Back to my question about. graphics versus videos. Yeah. You mentioned earlier having like Canva templates. You mentioned uh you said the. word graphics a few times. Do graphics or you know quote unquote still images. perform better? Is that more of the norm and the expectation on Pinterest than these 7-second reels that are being. posted on Instagram? Yes. Okay. So, this will maybe give your audience another sigh of relief, but I just saw a stat. that it said like the average reel is taking entrepreneurs three to four hours based on what they're creating, which I. haven't made sure, but for me that's kind of true. Takes me a long time. Uh, but what we've done is like in my. business is for every podcast episode that goes out, I created 10 templates to. turn one podcast episode into 10 graphics. One graphic is just the title. of my show. Then the next graphic is the title of my show with my photo. Then the next graphic is a pull quote from the. episode. The next graphic could be an infographic. Again, it's just slightly varying either the way that you're. talking about the episode or the way the graphic is. One thing that's really great about Pinterest is that it's not. necessarily the popularity contest that social media can feel like because users on there aren't specifically generally. typing in your name unless you're super well-known. People aren't going onto Pinterest and typing in your name. So,. there's a stat that 96% of searches on Pinterest are unbranded searches,. meaning that people are really interested in being exposed to new creators, new offers, new products,. which is a huge relief for small businesses and people that are just starting out. Like the other day, I was. looking for a red dress and I had like a specific vision in my mind and I just couldn't find what I was looking for. And it was popping up all these different boutiques I would have never found. I would have never heard of. I don't care where I'm getting this red. dress from. I just want to find what I'm looking for. And so what's awesome about Pinterest is for people that prefer to. be a little bit more faceless in their marketing or they want to not necessarily be like the performer in. their business, Pinterest is amazing. And so for you, Brock, you have such SEO. optimized titles, which I know is strategic on your part when it comes to YouTube. And so there are so many. different ways that you could take one YouTube episode and take different clips, use stock photos, plain. backgrounds, talk to different segments of your audience. Like you could do one like Instagram strategies for small. business owners, Instagram strategies for course creators, Instagram strategies for product based businesses. So all of these different ways are easy ways to create new graphics that promote and point to the same thing. So, what I. rely on is just templates. And here's the secret sauce of this. At this point,. I don't even do my own Pinterest strategy. I outsource the one hour a week to an amazing VA on my team because. once the templates are created, all she does is take that piece of published content and dissect it and break it down. and she's ready to rock. And keeping in mind, if you think about it, one episode of your show turning into 10 pins, the. average lifespan of one pin is 13 months. Now think about 10 pins being. published spaced out over a period of time. Your episode that you're recording right now can be working for you in the. next year. And I feel like that's just such a different mentality than social. media where it's just like we're constantly creating and kind of feeding the beast. And so it totally transforms. the way that you create content and also the way that you look at the promotion of the content you create. I love it. We. are 100% going to implement everything you are saying. And so I'm speaking right now to the person in the future. who I bet is finding this episode on Pinterest and then now they're watching. this episode. It's kind of like this. It's meta. I like it. Pinterest inception. Yeah, I love it. Um, okay. Okay. So, you mentioned spacing them out over a period of time and you know I understand that if I space them out then. it's just going to extend the life the lifespan so to speak. Um but in terms of frequency on Instagram we say the more. you post the more you grow. On Tik Tok the same is true. Um what is there is. there best practice and I know you know Pinterest isn't like you said earlier it's not a social media as much. It's. more of a search engine. So is it truly the more the marrier with posting on Pinterest? Is it, hey, give them at. least an hour so they can breathe. What's the best practice in terms of frequency? Okay, you're going to love. this. Okay, so the way that I teach it is it literally takes 1 hour a week. You. can log in and you can log out. So unlike the social platforms, and again, this isn't a comparison. It's just. pointing the distinction. Unlike the social platforms where you shouldn't just like post and ghost, you need to. stay on and engage and be in your DMs. This is truly a you upload it and you. can ghost because it's not necessarily about likes and comments and that kind of thing. So, it's a very different. mindset. So, what we recommend is even if you just uploaded one to two fresh. pins, fresh just meaning different variations. It can be old content being resurfaced, but fresh graphics to. Pinterest a day, you can get really great success. So, that's just one to two. So that would be about creating 14. different graphics in Canva in one week pointing to different types of work that you've done. Now the recommendation and. what we do personally on my team because we have such a gold mine of content. We. have thousands upon thousands of posts and episodes and all the different things is that we typically post around. five to 15 pins a day. Now when I say we're posting it, we're just scheduling. these out to be dropping. And it's pretty easy to do that when you have templates to rely on and you can look at. a piece of content and splice and dice it. In fact, you can go into chat GBT and you could upload a transcript of. this episode and say, "Give me 10 different angles for this." And it would literally spit out amazing headlines. that you could use on these graphics. So, the one thing to keep in mind is that if you have a piece of content and. let's say Brock, you create 10 pins for it. My recommendation would be is if you. have enough content to do this, which you do, would be to space out those pins at least by one week, just so you're not. spamming Pinterest with all of these pins that are super similar pointing to that one piece of content. If you can't. do that, you're not going to be penalized. You likely just might not get as great of results. And so if. somebody's listening, my recommendation would be pick three pieces of content that you've already created that maybe. performed well in the past and create, let's say, three different pins for that. That'd be nine pins. That would be. enough to get the one to two pins per day for the next week. And you could schedule it, set it, and forget it, and. then log in again on Monday. So that's kind of how we approach it. Um, there's. really not a ton of rules. Like what's interesting to me is it doesn't ever feel like you're like gaming the system. Um I've been teaching Pinterest for seven years now, like teaching the strategy. And what's incredible is is. like I just re-recorded my entire program and not a lot had changed. Like it wasn't like this massive shift from. like, oh my gosh, last year to this year there's this algorithm drop and everything is not working. And so that. gives me a lot of peace in the process. They also recently announced a verified Pinterest educators program which I'm a. part of. And I also just think that that is awesome in the sense of it's not like you're gaming a system. I think. sometimes we can get strategies and it kind of feels like well this could work for now but it might not work in a month. Uh they're backing what we teach. And so I just want you your listeners to listen with a lens of like this isn't about gaming it. This is exactly how. they want you to be using it. Gotcha. That makes sense. And that's so cool. Congratulations on that. I I love uh you. know and it totally makes sense that you are one of those verified educators because you're someone who teaches. strategies that are proven to work and will work over the long haul and it's not like a flash in the pan hack that's. going to work for the next 12 hours and then hey if you don't see this episode the day it was posted it's gone forever. But speaking of those strategies, I would love to first of all just understand um and this might be a very. silly beginner question, but on Instagram we have stories, we have carousels like the slideshows, we have. photos, and we have reals um and we have live. Um what are the different kinds of. content that we can post or the different kinds of posts we can pin on Pinterest? Yeah. So the main one that is. like 98% of what we do is just a singular graphic. It is just one single. standalone graphic. Now they have recently released like carousels where you can have multiple pins. It's limited. to five. So it's kind of like a series of five where people can scroll through and then they also do video pins, but. they're often no audio. It's just like a video clip. So, a lot of times my team will take my reels that I post that are. more like B-roll, which we all know aren't working as great these days. Um, but they can take that content and also. post it onto Pinterest. There is also one thing that I think is interesting to call out is that there's Pinterest ads. And for most of my career on Pinterest, we've gone straight organic. Like no. paid strategy, gotten results with no paid strategy. But one thing that's been interesting is as we've been using. Pinterest ads more, we've been seeing that our cost per lead for our last launch was nearly half of the cost per. lead that we were getting on Meta, which is really interesting because we're not. anti-ta. Like I use Instagram and Facebook all the time and that's how we get a ton of leads. But it was wild. because we were able to track the performance of Pinterest users all the way through the funnel and those leads. performed the same as our meta leads but the cost was 1/ half. Why this is important is I think a lot of people do. feel slightly stuck with like all the eggs in one basket, right? And if something changes or something's not. working, it's not like you can just throw spaghetti at the wall without a cost. And so Pinterest ads are also a. really awesome place. And what we also realized through Pinterest ads is that we were being exposed to people that. wouldn't have naturally been in our world or in our ecosystem. So with Pinterest ads, you can also leverage the. single graphics or the videos. And a lot of times we'll just take what's already working, resize it for Pinterest, which. now Instagram is is actually the formatting matches a lot easier um with the more uh portrait style fitting. Um. and so it's really not a lot of extra work on our part. They've done different things in the past where like you can. literally click and get taken directly to the shop. So, it's a really direct path for product based businesses where. it literally takes somebody to check out. And if they have like Shop Pay or Shopify, it's like, "Oh my god, I could. literally buy something in about 5 seconds." Um, and so they're always kind of trying different things, but the main. one that we do is just a single graphic. And it's so easy to create a single graphic for basically anything you've. already made. Totally makes sense. Let's talk more about some of the best practices for those single graphics. I'm. just curious um you know, have you found that portrait works better than landscape? Is there a certain amount of. words or a certain like um you know, should we have a human's face on it plus a headline plus a subheader? Like what. is the best practice? And I'm sure it varies person to person, business to business, but are there any general uh. things to keep in mind with those graphics? Yes. So, we only do vertical oriented pins because just like on. Instagram, it takes a more landscape visually. So, again, a lot of similarities there. Now, one of my. favorite things about Pinterest is you can split test any idea, any headline,. any graphic, any color, any font. You can split test anything with no risk or. without feeling like you're standing on stage naked in front of your audience. And so it removes the vulnerability that. a lot of people feel in desiring to test or experiment with something because. it's like on Instagram, you know, trial reels, I guess, kind of did that for us a little bit like takes away the the. barrier of embarrassment or vulnerability. But what's incredible about Pinterest is like you get the. analytics. So we've done it to like split test ad graphics or different things like that. The point of this is. is that there's no risk of having a bad graphic. So, you're not penalized or it's not going to negatively impact you. It'll just give you data. But the main things that we found are a really clear headline just like you would do a hook. on Instagram. Um, howto articles do so well on Pinterest. When you think of a. search engine, a lot of times you're typing in like how do how do I start a podcast or how do I leverage Instagram. stories? So, how to do really really well. A lot of our graphics will have some sort of call to action. Again, very. similar to Instagram, but just a little button that says click me. The button itself is not clickable, but the graphic. is. And then we often will see that our greater results comes from graphics that. don't have my face on me because remember, it's unbranded searches. People aren't necessarily looking for. me. They're looking for an answer. And so, the majority of our pins are not highlighting Jenna Kutcher. They're. highlighting the content. and it helps you to connect that content to the person and then they can get to know you. in the content piece itself. And so again, for people that want to take a little step back or not necessarily be. the face, it's amazing. But I just love it because it's like Brock, let's say tomorrow you're like, I want my brand to. be like orange and lime green. You could test that out and split test it using. similar graphics with different branding and just see what performs better. And so it's kind of a good testing ground. for people, too. Gotcha. I totally see how this makes so much sense. I see how. I could do this in less than an hour a week. I see how I could have someone on our team do this. I also am imagining. I'm probably not technical enough to figure it out, but there are probably people listening who are technical enough to figure out how to do a lot of. this automatically with AI, which is super cool. But I also know that there's even more strategy. There's those. templates that you talked about, and I know you have an upcoming webinar. So, can you tell us a little bit more about that? Yes. Okay. So, I just want to tell. everyone here's what I want you to know. To learn the system, it doesn't take a long time. Like, it is not this process. where it's like 800 steps and you've got to figure it out. It's very simple and that's why I love it. So, my upcoming. master class is called create once traffic for months. How to lengthen the lifespan of your content and make your. work work for you. And I love teaching this because at the heart of my mission. is to allow people to have life first businesses. Brock, you are someone who I admire, who I know you have hobbies, and. I want my work to be the least interesting part of my life. Like I want to live just such a full life. And so as. summer is coming and people's time is about to evaporate and they want to be spending their time in other places, let. me show you the 1 hour a week strategy that can make your work work for you and. that can help you spend your precious time in a way that gives you a true result. So if you sign up, you can go to. teachmetopin.com. That's teach me topin.com. Save your seat. I would love to just walk you through this process. and help your work live on and create the results that you want it to create. Amazing. Well, we will link that up in the show notes below. But, uh, thank you so much for being here. Two final quick. questions. One is last words of advice, any parting messages, anything that you want to share with our audience before. we part ways. So, I would say define what your version of success is. And for. me, I used to focus on what success looked like. And now I focus on what success feels like. And for me, it's. being able to step off of the content creation hamster wheel and have work that is working for me in the. background. Like nothing is sexier going to bed at night knowing that my work is driving results for me. And so, how do. you want your life to feel? And the second thing is is that treat time is your currency. So look at where your. time is going and make sure that every hour of your time has an ROI that feels worth it to you. And for me, I love. Instagram. I show up on there every day, but my real ROI is coming from the traffic that Pinterest is driving,. leveraging all the things I've been creating. Amazing. And we will link up, like I said, the master class in the. show notes. But where's the best place to get connected with you just if we want to follow more all things Jenna and. check out more of what you're up to? Yes. Well, I'll tell you Pinterest, uh, which you can find me, Jenna Kutcher,. um, and Instagram is Jenna Kutcher. And I would love for you to also listen to the Gold Digger podcast. I got to tell. them our quick funny story, Brock, about what happened. So Brock is going to be on my podcast. It's such a killer. episode. I have been in the podcast game for a long time. Hundreds of episodes, over 100 million downloads. Poor Brock. comes on my podcast and I hit the wrong record button. People, if you have ever. been mortified, if you wonder if the great still mess up, the answer is absolutely positively. And I'm so. grateful that I messed up with someone as amazing as Brock. So, come and listen. to his episode on my show because it's the second crack at it. And the second time was even better than the first. Um,. but I'd love to have you listen in at the Gold Digger Podcast where you can hear amazing people just like Brock. Definitely amazing podcast and I'll link that up in the show notes as soon as that specific episode comes out. But that was a blast. And even today, uh,. you and I and I I think it's important for people to hear not just about the, uh, forgetting to hit record or that. technical issue, but also even today, uh, with this conversation. We've been talking about having this conversation. around Pinterest for a while. And we literally planned this via text about 10 minutes before we got started. I was. like, "Hey, do you want to do it now?" I was about to go for a hike, but we changed our mind. She's like, "Yeah, let's do it now." And then I sent her. the link, and here we are. So, anyways, Jenna, you are amazing. such a light and thank you for being here today. Thank. you for having me. Before you go, I do have one final question and it is, would you like me to do more interviews here. on Build Your Tribe? Of course, now that Shellene isn't the co-host anymore and it's just me, that kind of opens us up. for some more experts to come on. And I am definitely open to interviewing more experts like Jenna or like Adam Moseri,. the head of Instagram that we've already had on the show. So, let me know down in the comments if you're watching on YouTube. Would you like to hear from. more guest experts and interviews? Or if not, is there a topic that you would like me to address and talk about in a. future episode of Build Your Tribe? Thank you so much for being here this week.